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	<title>Comments on: Pai murder- The Human Rights Report Feb 17 2008 + ThaiVisa.com controversy</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.andrew-drummond.com/2008/02/17/canadian-shootings-thailand-the-human-rights-report-feb-17-2008/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.andrew-drummond.com/2008/02/17/canadian-shootings-thailand-the-human-rights-report-feb-17-2008/</link>
	<description>Journalist covering Bangkok, Thailand and Southeast Asia</description>
	<pubDate>Thu, 04 Dec 2008 04:16:10 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Andrew Drummond</title>
		<link>http://www.andrew-drummond.com/2008/02/17/canadian-shootings-thailand-the-human-rights-report-feb-17-2008/#comment-856</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew Drummond</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 02 Mar 2008 06:28:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.andrew-drummond.com/2008/02/17/canadian-shootings-thailand-the-human-rights-report-feb-17-2008/#comment-856</guid>
		<description>EXPLANATORY NOTE: Mary-Jane is the sister of Canadian Dale Henry who was murdered in Ranong earlier this year. His Thai wife, her lover, a third man who carried out the shooting are being held by police.
There is a separate thread on Thaivisa.com. In this thread ThaiVisa members were very helpful to Dale's family</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>EXPLANATORY NOTE: Mary-Jane is the sister of Canadian Dale Henry who was murdered in Ranong earlier this year. His Thai wife, her lover, a third man who carried out the shooting are being held by police.<br />
There is a separate thread on Thaivisa.com. In this thread ThaiVisa members were very helpful to Dale&#8217;s family</p>
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		<title>By: Mary-Jane Matheson</title>
		<link>http://www.andrew-drummond.com/2008/02/17/canadian-shootings-thailand-the-human-rights-report-feb-17-2008/#comment-850</link>
		<dc:creator>Mary-Jane Matheson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 01 Mar 2008 10:33:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.andrew-drummond.com/2008/02/17/canadian-shootings-thailand-the-human-rights-report-feb-17-2008/#comment-850</guid>
		<description>I do post on Thaivisa and have felt it a way to release a lot of what I'm feeling as well as express gratitude from the many people who stood up to the plate in our defence. Even though I don't feel that should have been needed. My brother Dale lived in Thailand long before he met the love (death) of his life. He trusted her with his life. In my eyes she is evil and as cruel as cruel gets as well as her partners in crime. Who really knows how many that entails. As I have learned, a great many more than people realize. Why is the Mother of Maneerat free. She was also present in Dales home at the time of his murder. Her and a bunch are still their. They can go back to whereever they came from, all I care about are his animals. At least you know where you stand with an animal. She was the one at the funeral who piggishly stole all the money gifted to the family to cover expenses...which were paid by us. They laughed when I arrived...I hope he haunts you all forever. I know he will. His heart and trust was trampled on to the most disgusting degree by many I'm learning. He loved your country so much and was proud enough to embed that in his skin. Shame on you all...you know who you are. I alone just for travel and expenses the costs exceeded $7000. That did not include funeral costs. My brother wanted to move here to keep a part of Dale. It is a beautiful country but not ours. I will fight him with all I have. I am his big sister and all that he has anymore to look out for him!!
Nee you looked like you were at home behind those monkey bars!! Not a tear fell from your eyes. ENJOY!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I do post on Thaivisa and have felt it a way to release a lot of what I&#8217;m feeling as well as express gratitude from the many people who stood up to the plate in our defence. Even though I don&#8217;t feel that should have been needed. My brother Dale lived in Thailand long before he met the love (death) of his life. He trusted her with his life. In my eyes she is evil and as cruel as cruel gets as well as her partners in crime. Who really knows how many that entails. As I have learned, a great many more than people realize. Why is the Mother of Maneerat free. She was also present in Dales home at the time of his murder. Her and a bunch are still their. They can go back to whereever they came from, all I care about are his animals. At least you know where you stand with an animal. She was the one at the funeral who piggishly stole all the money gifted to the family to cover expenses&#8230;which were paid by us. They laughed when I arrived&#8230;I hope he haunts you all forever. I know he will. His heart and trust was trampled on to the most disgusting degree by many I&#8217;m learning. He loved your country so much and was proud enough to embed that in his skin. Shame on you all&#8230;you know who you are. I alone just for travel and expenses the costs exceeded $7000. That did not include funeral costs. My brother wanted to move here to keep a part of Dale. It is a beautiful country but not ours. I will fight him with all I have. I am his big sister and all that he has anymore to look out for him!!<br />
Nee you looked like you were at home behind those monkey bars!! Not a tear fell from your eyes. ENJOY!</p>
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		<title>By: Damian Mavis</title>
		<link>http://www.andrew-drummond.com/2008/02/17/canadian-shootings-thailand-the-human-rights-report-feb-17-2008/#comment-780</link>
		<dc:creator>Damian Mavis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Feb 2008 05:16:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.andrew-drummond.com/2008/02/17/canadian-shootings-thailand-the-human-rights-report-feb-17-2008/#comment-780</guid>
		<description>I asked them to cancel my membership but apparently all they can do is "ban" people so now I am banned from Thaivisa.  I simply refuse to be a part of a forum that openly stands in the way of justice and fights against "right" in an obvious situation of right and wrong.  They were repeatedly deleting posts from myself and others in a debate over the pai shootings which is ridiculous when you consider the person deleting the posts is also the main contributor to the opposing viewpoint... a complete and obvious conflict of interest.  My posts didn't break their rules, as I'm sure other peoples didn't either, the mod "Sabaijai/Cummings" simply disagreed with them and wanted his voice and opinion to stand brighter than anyone elses.  

Don't they think it's odd that all the people that told it like it was going to happen turned out to be totally correct and now we are no longer there?  Shouldn't it be the other way around?  No I guess not....

Anyway, please keep up the good work Mr. Drummond, as far as I'm concerned you are the only one out there fighting for justice from the beginning and as a direct result of your work there has been positive movement towards actual justice for the murder of Leo Del Pinto.

Damian Mavis</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I asked them to cancel my membership but apparently all they can do is &#8220;ban&#8221; people so now I am banned from Thaivisa.  I simply refuse to be a part of a forum that openly stands in the way of justice and fights against &#8220;right&#8221; in an obvious situation of right and wrong.  They were repeatedly deleting posts from myself and others in a debate over the pai shootings which is ridiculous when you consider the person deleting the posts is also the main contributor to the opposing viewpoint&#8230; a complete and obvious conflict of interest.  My posts didn&#8217;t break their rules, as I&#8217;m sure other peoples didn&#8217;t either, the mod &#8220;Sabaijai/Cummings&#8221; simply disagreed with them and wanted his voice and opinion to stand brighter than anyone elses.  </p>
<p>Don&#8217;t they think it&#8217;s odd that all the people that told it like it was going to happen turned out to be totally correct and now we are no longer there?  Shouldn&#8217;t it be the other way around?  No I guess not&#8230;.</p>
<p>Anyway, please keep up the good work Mr. Drummond, as far as I&#8217;m concerned you are the only one out there fighting for justice from the beginning and as a direct result of your work there has been positive movement towards actual justice for the murder of Leo Del Pinto.</p>
<p>Damian Mavis</p>
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		<title>By: Andrew Drummond</title>
		<link>http://www.andrew-drummond.com/2008/02/17/canadian-shootings-thailand-the-human-rights-report-feb-17-2008/#comment-775</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew Drummond</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 Feb 2008 09:27:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.andrew-drummond.com/2008/02/17/canadian-shootings-thailand-the-human-rights-report-feb-17-2008/#comment-775</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Explanatory note: Thaivisa.com is a blog for expatriates in Thailand. I had been submitting posts to this website through my colleague ‘Claymore’ mainly to answer the school of thought that Carly Reisig was to blame for the murders, because of her past behaviour, and to help put the train of thought in the right direction, that espoused by another poster called ‘Arkady’ that Thai police were being economical with the truth.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;(Carl Reisig btw had hit or pushed a policeman in an incident in a bar in which police were threatening to arrest her Thai boyfriend)&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;The main champion of the ‘she had it coming’ school of thought was a poster using the name ‘sabaijai’. He, in essence, forwarded the view that there was no climate of fear from police, and posted a number of condescending and derogatory remarks about sensational journalism.  &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Pretty much everybody in Pai was saying it was Carly’s fault, according to ‘sabaijai’, who comically referred to me as a journalist who used to ring up somebody he knew in Chiang Mai asking ‘Any dead Brits?’.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;The family of Del Pinto reacted accordingly, as one can see in a letter posted on this site www.andrew-drummond.com and in The Nation newspaper.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I knew from an early stage the identity of the poster. It was a well known author of the Thailand Lonely Planet guidebooks, Joe Cummings who spends his life between Chiang Mai and Pai, who now occasionally plays in a band.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;(Claymore incidentally had made it clear he was posting messages from Andrew Drummond)&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Mr.Cummings is a former Peace Corps volunteer turned writer respected for his travel reports. His experience in investigative journalism outside the realm of value for money guest houses is rather limited.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;When ‘Sabaijai’ (also a super-moderator on ThaiVisa.com) contributed a post saying that he had no commercial or business interests in Pai, Chiang Mai, or for that matter, anywhere in Thailand, I felt it essential to point out this was blatantly not true. Sabaijai as a super-moderator was actively editing posts in the same thread, while in fact he has been a key figure in the backpacker industry for many years, and even wrote a column for the Pai Post, under the same name Sabaijai. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;When Ross Wilson made the film ‘Who Killed Kirsty Jones?” based on my investigations for ‘The Times’  Joe Cummings was used as a ‘talking head’ which is what he is more used to. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;(“Thais are more tactile now. Before they would not even approach a female foreign tourist etc. etc”). Though in his blogs he gives the impression he was ‘on the case’.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Simultaneously residents of Pai, who had remained quiet suddenly started, contributing posts disagreeing with ‘sabaijai, saying relations with the police in Pai were by no means fine and dandy, and yes people were scared of the local police who had acquired a very bad reputation. Nevertheless Joe Cummings was still editing posts&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Having ‘outed’ Sabaijai as Joe Cummings, Claymore was banned from Thai Visa as of course this is against ThaiVisa rules. So was the poster Westerby, who posted in my support and who made contact with me with by this post 'Westerby'. He was banned because people thought he was 'Claymore' Another moderator, who supported my line was also relieved of her duties, and posters are continually emailing me now to say their posts have either edited or cut completely.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;At the moment I view this website but will no longer contribute. I prefer the view of qualified editors. I take no delight in reporting now that most of my articles have turned out to be correct and the Thai government has now promised transparency into how Leo Del Pinto was killed.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;*The 'George' referred to is the big boss at ThaiVisa.com&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Explanatory note: Thaivisa.com is a blog for expatriates in Thailand. I had been submitting posts to this website through my colleague ‘Claymore’ mainly to answer the school of thought that Carly Reisig was to blame for the murders, because of her past behaviour, and to help put the train of thought in the right direction, that espoused by another poster called ‘Arkady’ that Thai police were being economical with the truth.</p>
<p>(Carl Reisig btw had hit or pushed a policeman in an incident in a bar in which police were threatening to arrest her Thai boyfriend)</p>
<p>The main champion of the ‘she had it coming’ school of thought was a poster using the name ‘sabaijai’. He, in essence, forwarded the view that there was no climate of fear from police, and posted a number of condescending and derogatory remarks about sensational journalism.  </p>
<p>Pretty much everybody in Pai was saying it was Carly’s fault, according to ‘sabaijai’, who comically referred to me as a journalist who used to ring up somebody he knew in Chiang Mai asking ‘Any dead Brits?’.</p>
<p>The family of Del Pinto reacted accordingly, as one can see in a letter posted on this site <a href="http://www.andrew-drummond.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.andrew-drummond.com</a> and in The Nation newspaper.</p>
<p>I knew from an early stage the identity of the poster. It was a well known author of the Thailand Lonely Planet guidebooks, Joe Cummings who spends his life between Chiang Mai and Pai, who now occasionally plays in a band.</p>
<p>(Claymore incidentally had made it clear he was posting messages from Andrew Drummond)</p>
<p>Mr.Cummings is a former Peace Corps volunteer turned writer respected for his travel reports. His experience in investigative journalism outside the realm of value for money guest houses is rather limited.</p>
<p>When ‘Sabaijai’ (also a super-moderator on ThaiVisa.com) contributed a post saying that he had no commercial or business interests in Pai, Chiang Mai, or for that matter, anywhere in Thailand, I felt it essential to point out this was blatantly not true. Sabaijai as a super-moderator was actively editing posts in the same thread, while in fact he has been a key figure in the backpacker industry for many years, and even wrote a column for the Pai Post, under the same name Sabaijai. </p>
<p>When Ross Wilson made the film ‘Who Killed Kirsty Jones?” based on my investigations for ‘The Times’  Joe Cummings was used as a ‘talking head’ which is what he is more used to. </p>
<p>(“Thais are more tactile now. Before they would not even approach a female foreign tourist etc. etc”). Though in his blogs he gives the impression he was ‘on the case’.</p>
<p>Simultaneously residents of Pai, who had remained quiet suddenly started, contributing posts disagreeing with ‘sabaijai, saying relations with the police in Pai were by no means fine and dandy, and yes people were scared of the local police who had acquired a very bad reputation. Nevertheless Joe Cummings was still editing posts</p>
<p>Having ‘outed’ Sabaijai as Joe Cummings, Claymore was banned from Thai Visa as of course this is against ThaiVisa rules. So was the poster Westerby, who posted in my support and who made contact with me with by this post &#8216;Westerby&#8217;. He was banned because people thought he was &#8216;Claymore&#8217; Another moderator, who supported my line was also relieved of her duties, and posters are continually emailing me now to say their posts have either edited or cut completely.</p>
<p>At the moment I view this website but will no longer contribute. I prefer the view of qualified editors. I take no delight in reporting now that most of my articles have turned out to be correct and the Thai government has now promised transparency into how Leo Del Pinto was killed.</p>
<p>*The &#8216;George&#8217; referred to is the big boss at ThaiVisa.com</p>
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		<title>By: westerby</title>
		<link>http://www.andrew-drummond.com/2008/02/17/canadian-shootings-thailand-the-human-rights-report-feb-17-2008/#comment-772</link>
		<dc:creator>westerby</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 Feb 2008 21:27:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.andrew-drummond.com/2008/02/17/canadian-shootings-thailand-the-human-rights-report-feb-17-2008/#comment-772</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Nailing my colours to your mast led to a rather earlier exeunt than I would have preferred but that's Thaivisa for you.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;George is concerned that two top journalists are seen fighting on TV but quite how he could include that American *** in such an assessment is somewhat mystifying. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Keep up your usual standard of work and we may yet see another addled custodian of the dubious Thai peace suitably incarcerated.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt; &lt;strong&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nailing my colours to your mast led to a rather earlier exeunt than I would have preferred but that&#8217;s Thaivisa for you.</p>
<p>George is concerned that two top journalists are seen fighting on TV but quite how he could include that American *** in such an assessment is somewhat mystifying. </p>
<p>Keep up your usual standard of work and we may yet see another addled custodian of the dubious Thai peace suitably incarcerated.</p>
<p> <strong></strong></p>
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		<title>By: Kat</title>
		<link>http://www.andrew-drummond.com/2008/02/17/canadian-shootings-thailand-the-human-rights-report-feb-17-2008/#comment-771</link>
		<dc:creator>Kat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 Feb 2008 16:58:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.andrew-drummond.com/2008/02/17/canadian-shootings-thailand-the-human-rights-report-feb-17-2008/#comment-771</guid>
		<description>Yes, this was a violation of human rights by state officials, both in the initial incident and attempted cover-up.  This has serious implications for Thailand if those attempts by the state police in Pai are not duly punished to the full extent of the law.  At this point, we are looking at more guilty parties than just the drunk, off-duty police officer.  Please make sure justice is done, for all of us.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, this was a violation of human rights by state officials, both in the initial incident and attempted cover-up.  This has serious implications for Thailand if those attempts by the state police in Pai are not duly punished to the full extent of the law.  At this point, we are looking at more guilty parties than just the drunk, off-duty police officer.  Please make sure justice is done, for all of us.</p>
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