Monday, June 4, 2012

Monday, June 04, 2012
108

Flying Sporran

Sunday June 4 2010




Well this is not quite a news flash. It happened on Saturday but regretfully Drummond  has been taken ill for the last 36 hours.

All current threats to www.andrew-drummond.com are now off.

At a court hearing in Pattaya Drew Noyes withdrew all actions.





 These include

 An injunction to have this site blocked

An injunction to have stories removed

A claim for 5 million baht in damages

 A case for criminal libel.


The agreement was made after Drew Noyes failed to succeed in actions to remove stories on this site, or have the site blocked. It was signed by both parties in Pattaya Court.

Details of this agreement will be published here later after independent translation.

As part of that agreement Andrew Drummond has withdrawn a complaint of criminal libel against Drew Noyes, which was approved by Bangkok Criminal Court last week. He has further agreed to remove certain ‘libelous’ statements from his site, ‘if he has made them’.*

Both sides have agreed not to write further stories against each other. However neither side is prevented from writing anything in the 'public interest'.



Said Andrew Drummond: “This is an excellent result. The fact that court realised I was working as an investigative journalist was clearly taken into account.

“This does not prevent this site continuing to report on Drew Noyes’ other legal cases for extortion and libel or any NEW actions. The judge has said there is no intention to stop me doing my job, and public interest overrides anything."



“It does however appear to prevent publication of  detailed material gathered in the United States some supplied by the Wilmington Morning Star - now the Star News - which was due to run on this site this week, because it is historical and merely backs up and adds to what has already been mentioned here. Further it was obtained for libel actions which no longer exist.



*Noyes case for removal of stories was abandoned after he was unable to show that alleged statements he referred to in his complaint actually appeared on this site.

Posts will be accepted. But posts attacking Drew Noyes would be regarded  as in breach of the agreement and not justified under the news rule and will not be published.

108 comments:

  1. Congratulations Andrew!
    A job well done, and get well soon.

    J.

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  2. Is the Colov action also withdrawn?

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  3. *Noyes case for removal of stories was abandoned after he was unable to show that alleged statements he referred to in his complaint actually appeared on this site.

    So was he lying or not? If this question infringes on the court agreement, then please remove it.

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  4. Andrew, so sorry to hear you were unwell, just at the moment of vindication.

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  5. What the result shows is that the early attempts to scare AD into silence or exile by threatening him with the cyber crimes police and libel actions have crumbled into dust. I don't agree with everything AD writes or says by any means, but the crucial point is that the Thai court recognises his right to probe and report in the public interest. You may have noticed he doesn't have a lot of competition around here.
    Personally, I prefer to see this site free of over-the-top personal abuse in the future, if that is what the court agreement says. Allowing people to get their rocks off on the site by rubbishing others, deserved or not, is best abandoned as it is becomes an addiction and, I strongly suspect, does not encourage advertisers which AD is seeking.

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  6. The noise watcherJune 4, 2012 at 8:44 PM

    Congratulations Andrew. A great win for what is real and just. Many have tried before you unsuccessfully but it was obvious from early on that you were more than his match. To Magnus Evans. You called Andrew a 'wanker'
    None of his stories have been removed. Not a single one. And there will be no 40 or 100 other cases brought against him.
    Good comments from Barry Kenyon, the Pattaya Today is the only real newspaper in Pattaya. Who owns it. The others all show the owners mixing with 'influential' people. From what i can tell, the owner of Pattaya Today is more interested in the news, rather than self promotion, so good luck to them, whoever they are.
    A great win Andrew.
    (Edited to include an answer - Noisewatcher)

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  7. Posts will be accepted. But posts attacking Drew Noyes would be regarded as in breach of the agreement and not justified under the news rule and will not be published.

    So Andrew we all gave money to help the legal fight but now we have all been gagged from Talking about Drew Noyes,I think we now need a voice on another website. To say I and others will be silenced will not happen sometime soon. Why would you possibly agree not to talk about a xxxx when it is in the public interest Andrew.

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  8. I won't say congratulation as I do not see it as being a victory, I do hope it brings some form of clarity to your endeavours and allows you to continue in bringing the plight of those who have been effected by the likes of Mr Noyes et al to the publics attention.

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  9. Great news Andrew, and one step in the right direction for some kind of justice.

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  10. June: This copy was sent to lawyers and approved. I have not said he was lying. He was asked by the court to point alleged libels out and did not do so. This will be clarified when the judgment comes through, as, if I am asked to remove something I have not written I cannot do so. I hope this claries this for you.

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  11. There never has been a Colov action

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  12. Khon Mask: Any contributors unhappy with my decision can contact me on this site.I think you misunderstand. I would have to defend a libel action and bring witnesses from abroad. Why defend it and waste everyone's money if he withdraws the case. In terms of me chasing cash. There is little evidence of it, or there will not be when it comes to the time. Withdrawing a criminal libel case (and I do not believe in criminal libel which the CPJ has strong views on) is a small price to pay. At best he will be fined (probably less than my court expenses). I think you are reading what you want to see in this result Khonmask.As for posts well they are not the same as news gathering in the public interest so I will be watching those closely.
    We have established in the court that the court cannot prevent reporting if it is in the public interest. THAT IS THE POINT AND THAT NO STORIES ARE BEING REMOVED AND ALL ACTIONS AGAINST ME HAVE BEEN CANCELLED

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  13. SkippylechihuahuaJune 4, 2012 at 11:29 PM

    I do not understand why you would agree to such an agreement if the bkk judge ruled that you had a case and that the pattaya judge could not rule against you?
    I fail to see the big picture? Would be nice to know why and were does NC fit in all this?
    Can the false articles on the net (P.Times) stay unchallenged or should they be removed?
    Hope you get better quick Andrew and thanks for the updates.
    EH

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  14. Lloyd: If there are new cases and they are in the public interest then yes they can be published.

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  15. Andrew I never said you were chasing money and I have supported you several times and would have continued to support you in a noble quest,
    For me not to be able to comment on a xxxxx if not libel is an infringement on my civil rights.

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  16. SkippylechihuahuaJune 5, 2012 at 12:21 AM

    Ok, thanks for that Andrew, the time difference between my post and previous questions &answers appearing is delayed. Now I get the big picture. I type with one finger, sorry.
    Best
    Regards EH

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  17. Sorry,in all the hurly burly I thought Colov had jumped on the waggon, too.
    Anyway, nothing like a bit of vindication to maintain morale. Well done! It takes courage to speak the truth here and your success will serve as a warning to the many other fraudsters that abound in Thailand they will no longer enjoy the fruits of their skullduggery with the impunity they have enjoyed hitherto.
    It occurs to me there is a gap in the English newspaper/magazine market here in Bangkok. Have you considered a weekly publication in which good journalism, insightful comment and interesting features might flourish? Such a periodical would inevitably attract advertising revenue and with a bit of luck, following wind and a decent Thai backer might have the legs to last the course.

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  18. A good result and in a sense a very "Thai" solution"
    I welcome the ban on personal an vindictive attacks. Let's stick to comments on investigative reporting (ie facts) and leave the rest to Thaivisa and Farangtalk

    And get well AD

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  19. Andrew I think what Khun mask and others fail to understand is that withdrawing a claim of libel and the actions that were initiated is not a matter to be taken lightly. Those who initiated the claim, and or supported the claims, that can be found to have done so with malicious intend or with no supporting evidence to justify the claim or to support the evidence and statements made by the claimants witnesses can be crminally prosecuted. To bring such claims in the first instance the court would be under the presumption that the plaintiff had irrefutable proof that the defendant had commitel libel, or that the plaintiff had evidence as such that the court would find the claim warranted. Courts do not like ficticious and malicious claims being made to stiffle a persons freedom of speach, even in Thailand.

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  20. There is no mystery about Pattaya Today. The Thai publisher and editor, for Siamese Vision Media Company, appears on the back page of every issue. There are foreign work permit holders. Perhaps the difference is that the management and staff of Pattaya Today are not trumpet players.
    As regards the hoary old argument that Andrew Drummond is sleeping with Pattaya Today (pass the sick bowl), none of the management or staff have never even met the guy. It is not necessary for Pattaya Today to justify running a short piece on the arrest of a "virtous" foreigner for alleged blackmail, carefully pointing out the not guilty plea I might add. What needed to be explained is why some local media chose to ignore the story even though the police arranged a press conference. Sorry, no cash prizes for solving this brain baffler.

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  21. Well this is certainly better than I heard yesterday so I apologise for my email sent in haste to you, Andrew expressing dissapointment that you had 'caved in'.

    We really need more information on the Noyes extortion trial and the other actions against them and as long as these continue to be reported then I'll be more than happy.

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  22. Khonmask: If you comment here and make an insult - as you have just done - then its me who has to defend the action whether a court rules it is libel or not. Sod your civil rights.

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  23. Hi Andrew,
    Well done I guess ,
    It all just seems like a victory by penalty shoot out .
    It may also give others the same idea to sue the site to death until the funds run out.
    Anyway most people know who and what he is by now which is the whole point really.
    You are a Journalist not a policeman

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  24. Westerby: I went down that route last year - plan producing another national English language newspaper. Did a business plan, print & circulation costings, spoke to many journalists,some exceedingly good, in all spheres, costed the usual stuff like cartoons, wire services, guardian/observer. times/sundaytimes, foreign services etc, costed print. Had arrangemnts to deliver to all 7-11s and or selected 7-11s in all foreign areas etc (at a price but worth it) spoke to ad staff on BP and Nation, had many people who wanted to join in - but local factors changed my mind. I also looked at the mirror and thought "I'm old enough". I don't want my kids to grow up without me. At heart I am just a reporter, one who does investigations. When I was in Fleet Street I turned down executive roles which would have put me on a desk because I did not want to be like them!

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  25. + 1 for Enigma's comment.

    I personally don't feel the need to comment on every story just to comment, if I felt that compelled to do so and it was outside the new rules or over the line I would contact you directly and ask you to incorporate my feelings in an update on the site, but it's your call afterall it's your site. AD.com offers news but more importantly warnings to others about the pitfalls of dealing with some folks out there in LOS. I'm always a glass half full kind of guy so if we have to curtail rants so be it, I never cared about freedom of expression, no one listens to me anyway LOL

    Get better Andrew.

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  26. Andrew i was directing the comment at the courts not you,I thought you as a journalist would defend freedom of speech.

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  27. Khonmask: Yes that's what we were defending and it has been protected. It just does not protect me from posters making allegations which I have to justify. Actually this applies irrespective of the court's judgment. Perhaps I can put it this way. We have had the Glorious 12th of August but sure as the Lord made toffee apples it will come around again.

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  28. SkippylechihuahuaJune 5, 2012 at 4:17 AM

    Fair crack of the whip, Andrews work was outstanding and I think it was a good outcome, freedom of speech has been protected, however he who runs away shall live to fight another day! In the future I think it would be wiser to 'speak softly and carry a big stick'.
    Good luck with the future and we will continue to support you when needed.
    Regards
    EH

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  29. Whats the relation of the real estate photos...maybe I missed something, has been known to happen.

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  30. Sorry I can't answer that Sam. :-)

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  31. Perhaps, if this info from the states is damning as seems likely, it can be published elsewhere unless it needs a detailed background explanation....perhaps on Pat Angko's FB page or someone with HTML skills can throw a page together? Judging by the number of comments it seems there's an appetite for it...

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  32. Sam, re the photos. Read between photo 3 and photo 4. All shall become clear. I often had to read between the lines, but reading between the photos allows you to conjure up images which might help

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  33. Excellent outcome AD. Some of the writers need to put themselves in your shoes & see what its like when one goes to Court especially on these sorts of affairs. Outcomes may not end like one wants and especially in the Thai Judicial system but compromising can play its role in reaching an amicable conclusion. In your case you have managed this. Drew no doubt will rearrange his biz comments in the future but let’s hope at least, he has seen the light a little bit as well???. Well done.

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  34. My apologies for not saying so earlier. Thanks to the contributors to this site and those who recently topped me up. Most people have given up at the threats received. Through your help those threats have been seen off and we survive stronger than ever. Between us we have set a milestone in Thailand which will be hard to ignore.

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  35. Libel is only libel if it is a personal opinion unsubstantiated in fact or a malicious statement with the intent to injure or harm a persons reputation either personally or professionally. That's why I started to become a little concerned about references to individuals personal relationships mentioned here as they were leaning away from the matters on the table here.
    Regarding Andrews health as stated at the top of the page. What are we talking here? Is this pressure related, or something totally removed from the matters involved on this blog. Health issues are a personal matter I do understand, so what ever ails AD, I wish him a speedy recovery.

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  36. Good show old chap. Reading between the photos does not help cos I am thick, but I can presume, just my presumptions are often quite vividly wild and far stretched from reality. I can understand AD's desire to see an early end to it, ongoing drawn out legal proceedings can cause grey hair. It is a little disappointing for us though on the sidelines to not see something decisive and concrete against Noyes and then see a ban on discussion etc, but we as spectators to not have to deal with the crap involved. I have been in a Thai court system, never want to again...I imagine Jeffrey would feel the same...speaking of Jeffrey...where is he ??

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  37. Just a stomach thing I caught in Bali. Getting back to normal. Had breakfast today, first meal since Friday night

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  38. The noise watcherJune 5, 2012 at 7:43 PM

    Khon Mask, there is no point in suing somebody if they dont have much. Costs exceed the payout. With the US housing market in its current shape how much do you think that Drews lovely US house would be worth? But it is none of my business as long as he is paying his taxes in the US.
    Andrew adds “This does not prevent this site continuing to report on Drew Noyes’ other legal cases for extortion and libel or any NEW actions. The judge has said there is no intention to stop me doing my job, and public interest overrides anything.” The capitalised NEW makes me think that Andrew may have a few tricks up his sleeve still and Noise wont be able to relax just yet. Watch this space.
    Drew has the upcoming extortion case with his wife Wanrapa Boonsu and his former friend Andre is also suing him. This isn't the end, it is only the beginning. We will never stop watching.

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  39. A big congratulations to Thailand's only true INVESTIGATIVE reporter, Andrew Drummond and his flying sporran.
    The significance of this win should not be underestimated. Andrew never backed down, and why should he, despite a myriad of threats from a fake lawyer and his supporters with such names as the Dirty Dog. A lot of nasty things were said. Andrew held strong despite being in a country that is known for protecting people in influential positions and their friends. In a country where life is cheap and the powerful are protected. He is a braver man than most and much braver than somebody who wouldn't jump but was all to happy to show off his bravery award badge at every given oppurtunity.
    The dishonest people living here have something to fear now and it doesn't matter who you are connected to. The honest have prevailed and indeed came in large numbers to support Andrew in his quest. The other side did manage to get a key witness who now has egg covering his vegetarian face. And rightly so.People that he has never met, but people who could see right from wrong, donated money for the good fight.
    The truth will now prevail. The flying sporran is Thailand's new superhero.
    I am going out to celebrate now over a few Black and Cokes. Cheers Andrew Drummond.

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  40. Good news Andrew!

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  41. It's a good result and suits the Thai way of leaving some face and avoiding out and out conflict. Teakdoor would have liked more 'internet flamewars' and more 'comedy' but then that is up to them. This is the site to watch and support.

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  42. Terry: If there's ever a job going for my PR - you're the man! :-)

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  43. Double-Ditto what Terry said and my own whole-hearted congratulations and a thousand and one thanks.

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  44. Well what do you know two days our DN wend back to the restaurant News Cafe where he was arrested for blackmailing his Australian victim, he was totally cleared from any wrong doing he told the manager. It's almost like "no the cost of living is not higher, it's the heat what makes you think like that". Denial is the word, but it is actually an understatement in this case. But then again, denial is no stranger to people afflicted with psychopathy as is recorded since time immemorial. His request to see the CCTV footage of his arrest was declined. Hmmm, why wanting to look when you are cleared, right?

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  45. Andrew a tit bit late but I had to think long and deep before formulating my writing. In my humble OPINION and taking the risk of being branded negative this is not a victory, only convenience from your side, it appears somebody is off the hook............. again. I believe that you were on a winning streak as there were no evidence presented against your case here in PTY and the court ruled there was a case to answer in BKK. I think that your court cases were probably easily won if you carried on. Or am I missing something? The only reason you stopped was in your own words, it will save me months of being in court.
    The pressure is now off again in PTY, the deposit was returned from the court, you agreed not to dwell on the past and as you said, any victim has now to start their own court case. You are weakened. If claims are substantiated, then why should you not report them for it IS in the interest of the public. It allows people to escape their past deeds if this is the precedent to re-invent themselves. What is considered the past? A week, a year, a decade ? Quite a few victims had high hopes, which are now dashed by your decision. The bloggers applauding here are not victims, I think they probably don’t live here and do not know the complete picture, they are only readers.--------------- What happened to this one, ……… LET’S FIGHT THIS ONE. LET’S GET JUSTICE FOR THE VICTIMS AND SAFETY FOR THOSE WHO HAVE MADE THAILAND THEIR HOME……. Are you now saying justice has been served? Or in your own words, victims will have to start their own court case? What about the B 200,000 (as you mentioned) donated by your readers.-------------- Furthermore you wrote “And to the victims, and all those who have written, phoned, emailed, to say they wish to testify in court, well this is your day at last – get in touch.” Well they did and now what, if you start something and give in and then present it as a victory ? I understand you had Bali belly. Did this influence your decision to settle things in what appears to me, a little hasty. I was very surprised by your decision.
    You were provided with names and addresses, signatures were collected for you in order for you to proceed and now you step back because it saves you time? With your evidence and the lack of evidence against as you mention you blew it for the victims who’s stories you used.

    I am sorry, I am not negative as you wrote, I believe I am a realist, I don’t see any victory, at least not for his victims.

    Do you now set a precedent? do I need to write a name or should I write names? Other current cases maybe having a harder time now as this situation may boost an ego who uses anything to present as credible. This was the point. Time will tell if you were detrimental in removing him or if you actually did the opposite.

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  46. Pat Angko: It is wholly incorrect to say the only reason I came to an agreement was to save being months in court or that the pressue is off. Nor had I defended my self would the victims have been refunded. Here's the process. I win. DN appeals. I win again DN appeals again. The process in another case which I won on appeal has not finished. It was begun 12 years ago! Yes time in court is one factor. I have not had one single complaint from a contributor here. I did of course not have time to ask contributors whether to fight a case which would go on for years at a significant cost, which of course would have been another factor. Significantly I understand you could have pursued a case yourself but chose to not too...on the basis you had to deal with the reality of the situation. Please look at it in those terms. While everything appears not to be going as you wish, the actual victory was against what DN was trying to achieve most of all - to remove all stories about him from this site and the worldwide web -amd thus enable to him start afresh with no warnings out there. While it may sometimes have appeared so. This is not a site decicated to DN.Yes I am saying justice has been served..Thai style.
    PS: I have not a clue what you are talking about when you say 'deposit returned from court'.

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  47. Thankyou for your job offer, but I have been happily retired for 12 years. My blood pressure is high already and the threats I would recieve if I worked for you would be too much.
    Pat seems dissapointed. He is missing the larger picture.
    Up until Drummond rode into Pattaya with his sheriff's badge we had people who were born without a conscience believing they were above the law and treating people terribly. From staff not being paid all the way up to cons worth millions of baht. Everyone was considered a mark. People complained but no real action was ever taken. People bragged of corrupt officials and of being friends with people at the very top. Many lost money. As many had previously lost out in the USA. Publications were produced to mislead and were used to give the impression of respect and credability. Filled with content lifted from real news sources but passed off as their own and filled with misleading stories to make people believe they had problems that didn't exist and trick them into using the services of a fake posing as a lawyer. These are now treated as the sad joke that they are. (these people) are still trying, the new are now warned. Thwarting new scams.
    Previously if you were to search the internet you would find lie after lie of fantasists, claiming a myriad of complete and utter bullshit. This is still onlone but amongst these stories is the truth which makes the fantasy entries look even more absurd. Search google images now and you will find a photo put there by a man himself posing as a lawyer and a friend of local judges right next to a photo of him being arrested. It is quite amusing.
    An Australian who was allegedly extorted for 7 million baht, was made aware of this site. Would the result have been the same if it not for information here. Would he have had the confidence to stand up or would he have paid up and become another one of the long line of victims.
    Now we have a man who is facing proceedings. He is asking around for money. More than a few outstanding bills. People who are aware of this site, and that must be all of Pattaya, are less likely now to give this sweet talker anything.
    Before this site became what it is, many threats were made. Andrew published a lot of them, therefore letting everyone know the real thoughts behind the artificial smile. At least one woman was assaulted and made a police report and now this is on public record for all to see. Previously this was denied as was the past questionable activity in the USA.
    So now we have a man who is liked by a very few but hated by most. It doesn't seem to worry him and it appears the furtherest he is planning to go is Rayong.
    The court ruled that all the stories posted by Drummond could stay online. That is a win.

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  48. "Yes I am saying justice has been served..Thai style." you wrote, right that is thus clear, all long term "guests" know what that means. I am merely looking from the point of the victims, they are now required to fight an individual case instead of supporting you as witnesses. Their knight in shining armour has dismounted his white horse in their eyes. I am really shy to inform some of them, they had high hopes.
    PS: I have not a clue what you are talking about when you say ‘deposit returned from court’you wrote. According to you DN sued you in civil court for damages of 5 mln, court deposit to start such claim is 2%, this money he receives back. It is clear that the real fighting has to be done by PTY based people for this menace is not just about exposing his stories. Steps are contemplated to achieve this. I will contact you in due time, maybe what you "cannot" post, you can share, others can, especially what concerns his past. Bottom line, I do understand your position, but also the victim's and he has to be stopped at all cost.

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  49. I have not dismounted any horse Pat Angko. I am in touch with many of the victims. I repeat DN has withdrawn all cases. I have withdrawn one. Had I gone ahead with that case the best result would have been a fine. Not a deportation. I'm not sure what it is you do not understand. While I have supported the victims to the best of my journalistic ability - its not my job to support them in court (although any evidence gathered I can make available subject to the right permissions).. It would have been up to them to support me. As it is several victims were still asking for anonymity and others I would have had to pay expenses for to come from abroad - to defend me - not them. I do not believe you are representing the views of the victims. This is the last post on this subject unless I get floods of victims complaining. I think posters here are pretty much all unified on the subjects we are talking about. I cannot be everything to everybody. There is always one unhappy bunny. You have made your views known.
    Since writing this Pat Angko has sent in another post which I have deleted. He wishes me to acknowledge that he was a main source and contact to many of the victims, which I do. (But there are other main sources.) and (2) that he was on to DN long before myself, which I again acknowledge.

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  50. I tend to agree with Pat in this case. We were not of the understanding that this trip was a 'catch and release' when we hired the boat. You had him, should have put this pest species in the bucket, not back into the ocean to continue his feeding frenzy. He will be considering this a win and gloat. It will assist the constant flow of sewerage that flows from the mouth.

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  51. The Frying ScotsmanJune 9, 2012 at 8:23 PM

    I cannot believe the naivety of some of the posters on here. What did you expect? Andrew would wave a magic wand, and all the victims would get their money back? Or maybe he should have waited outside court and kicked the living Shit out of him? A Victory over Pattaya's gruesome twosome, however small some may consider it, is still a victory. I for one, think Andrew is to be congratulated. Not criticised

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  52. I agree, Flying Scotsman. I never cease to be amazed at the naivety of some farang in Thailand. They think with their western hats on and do not understand that Thai 'culture' works differently. AD has done more than most to publicise the 'warts' of Thailand so often papaered over by other sites.

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  53. FSM wrote "Andrew would wave a magic wand, and all the victims would get their money back? Or maybe he should have waited outside court and kicked the living Shit out of him?" Hmmm strange thoughts, do you really think this is what was expected? This I consider naive.

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  54. The Frying ScotsmanJune 9, 2012 at 10:59 PM

    Pat Angko
    Figuratively speaking, I consider that to be exactly, what some posters expected. They thought that this action would see the villain, banged up in jail or at least deported. In reality this was all about keeping this site open, and that was accomplished, therefore a victory. I am sure other pending actions ''MAY'' achieve the desired result, but this one was never going to. Anyone who thought otherwise were the naive ones

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  55. For my part I have to say this is a victory for Andrew. Without going into yards of self-indulgent bilge and twaddle, Andrew is still free to continue commenting on the Noise and the gang and all cases against Andrew and the site have been dropped.
    Where isn't the victory in that?

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  56. Thank you Ally. I am a journalist not a policeman. The only action that can put an end to the problem would have been a criminal action (not libel). So far no historic victim has taken a criminal action (apart from libel). There is however now one serious criminal action pending. That action was taken by someone who looked up this site and the blogspot site and was not scared to report the matter to police. The other way to solve the problem has been to make people aware. That's Done. So now we have to watch the ongoing criminal action. That is a legitimate public interest case. I thank Pat Angko and his fly for his pivotal role in getting the truth out. But we have to agree to differ on what was decided at Pattaya court.

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  57. You cannot all ride on the coat tails of Sir Drummond...those with real losses against this lot need to pony up and fight for themselves ultimately, this place and AD help provide information and other connections to like minded individuals, but he cannot be expected to fight the fight for you, assist for sure. If all those effected ponied up 5k baht each, or more most likely, perhaps he could have financed the ongoing decade forecast war without his own personal funds required for a fight that is not his...by that I mean the scams and losses of all here. He fought the current battle and won. We would all have liked to see more while sitting in our comfy chairs and watching from the sidelines, but thats just not cricket in reality.

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  58. I agree that it's a victory for AD and a setback for DN. If you google Drew Noyes or even Niels Colov the results prominently feature stories from this site exposing their capers. That alone should be enough to save some people the aggravation and expense of getting involved with them. No doubt this is also the reason DN initiated the legal action, which has effictively failed, and NC botherered to defend himself here.

    Let's hope that justice takes its course in the extortion case. Please keep us updated on the progress as needless to say its not being reported elsewhere.

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  59. Andrew, to agree that we differ is a no brainer, I do get that. Interesting to read some of the posters appear to be Mor Du or fortune tellers, they know what others think, very clever, I can't. The problem with any blog is some will write only in the role of bystander. Some will comment because they are involved and know in this case the villain personally. But then again, if everyone is allowed to have his say without being labeled then the blog has value I feel.

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  60. It can take 10 years or more for cases to wend their way through the hierarchy of the Thai courts. Normally people found guilty in a lower court will not be in jail but on bail (provided they have the funds for the bond). Since Andrew Drummond got all charges against his website dropped at the Pattaya court, there was no reason for him not to sign the agreement. Andrew could have been looking at the year 2022, or later, for a final judgment by the supreme court. All for the sake of a fine?

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  61. Barry Kenyon wrote "All for the sake of a fine?" Well with this train of thinking we do not need any courts and judges and lawyers, the 32 Baht solution will be encouraged 555 Anyway, thanks for listening to my observations on the phone this morning, they are unfortunately not really understood by most writers. I guess you have to live here and know inside details first?

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  62. I agree with you Sam. Those so willing to disembark with a few baht on a whim could all join forces by getting together as a group but then of course you need someone to lead it??? the hard part & then what--the next part. But I said it before if one is willing to give 2m baht+ just like that; 5k+ is not a lot to ask to help a person like AD who has put a lot on the line and as AD says he is a journalist.I myself would be looking behind my back all the time & heck my blood pressure is high enough now??? I don't wish to see another Court or Revenue dept ever again in the land of smiles if I can help it.

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  63. Well judging by all the "other story" comment numbers, it appears that The Flying Sporrans most visited stories are those relating to Pattaya and it's celebrities, and therein lay an interesting situ for AD.
    Youve struck a rich nerve in Pattaya Andrew, and as relevant as your other stories may be, it is the focus on Pattaya that seems to garner most attention. You have become THE credible alternative news site / media outlet people are following for the "real" story.
    If I had the money, I'd set up a newspaper there, and AD would be editor in Chief ( with a work permit of course).
    Let's keep dreaming .

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  64. Keith Elphick, others have realised this to and actually I started "Pat Angko exposes" on Facebook groups. I have tons of documents mostly concerning our Master Trickster(s) and am releasing them all in due time. Anyone may answer and comment without limitation, except for negative remarks about the Thai Royal Family or using serious swear words. You also may be repetitive if you feel, probably you have a good reason, not a complete answer or not receiving a satisfactory response may be one of them. What stops you and others, have a look at https://www.facebook.com/groups/patangko We are still in the migrating stage from the Pat Angko FB site so be patient. And no, I will never start a news paper, too much trouble:-)

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  65. Pat Angko has started a Facebook site, partially in protest about being censored on this site and perhaps for some more hardliners in relationship to Pattaya's strange newspaper publishers. The link is in his post. While no doubt there will be interesting documents going up on this site I do not subscribe to and will not support anonymous blogs which make accusations from behind a pseudonym.... The writing on such sites accompanying the documentation runs the risk of becoming exactly the kind of unregulated 'Pattaya journalism' which we object to here and the authors run the risk of being labelled internet warriors.

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  66. I agree, Andrew. We need creditable news and investigative sites like yours. Posting and flaming a la Thaivisa et al hopefully has had its day. It's amazing that that concept has lasted so long in Thailand and stranger still that expats have put up with it.

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  67. Thanks for placing my post Andrew. Now see the positive site. Just because it is anonymous thing can be aired in the interest of all Pattayans which a known writer cannot reveal out of fear of being sued in court. It is a win win. Of course it can be miss-used, but that is the responsibility of the writer, to have a high moral standard. Knowing the fly, he has.

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  68. I suggest enigma has a look before he responds. Too many bloggers sit home in their lazy chair and have an opinion about all what is going on. Step out and do something could be contemplated. Having a pre-conceived idea is actually prejudiced. The group is still migrating from the Pat Angko FB site and has difficulties which will be overcome. As I wrote to Andrew, between the two we have a broader front against the Master Tricksters which is only beneficial for Pattaya.

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  69. Fair comment, Pat. I will have a look. But my point about the way Thaivisa et al operate remains valid and I can't see your site being any different. Some of your posts and those supporting have been very one sided and had a "thaivisa' feel about them. Frankly, I hope I am wrong and wish the site well. Biased moderating and flaming will kill it as happened on farangtalk

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  70. Could Pat please put up a list of 'serious' swear words that are not allowed ? Thanks.

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  71. Hi Sam, How old are you? Don't tell me you need a list. If you don't know try it out on someone in front of you, when he punches your teeth out you wend too far;-)
    For Enigma, thanks, "Some of your posts and those supporting have been very one sided" That is correct, very anti scammers, liars, cheaters, thiefs and all of those. In my opinion some one has to point that out. I have so much information in the form of documents its unreal and I now have to see what to release and when. And this does not only contains the terrible two, there are more of them, unreal if you think of it Andrew did a good job but I know stuff which goes beyond "normal". Its actually a great burden, but to let these xxxxx (I censored myself) go free is even more of a burden to comprehend. BTW it is not my job, I am not a journalist, I have other things on my mind, but again someone has to do it.

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  72. That's the last plug Pat Angko :-)

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  73. Well looks like the gloves are now off. Pat's site has it all. Andrew you did a great job exposing Noyes and his uninfluential fake friends. You fought him fairly and with restrictions of the law. And you won everytime.
    Pat must be Noyes worst nightmare. No fair fight here. After your relentless pummeling that has left Noyes a shadow of his former self over the last 2 years, now we have Pat to finish him off with bomb after bomb.

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  74. I hope AD is on his way home from Phi Phi...

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  75. Here, here! Andrew. Anonymous blogs that instigate and carry on jihads against those they do not like are loathsome. Let them put their name where their mouth is. Even more despicable: those that have nothing better to do all day that trundle through these websites and contribute to the rubbish clogging the blogosphere. What is truly reprehensible--and indeed sad--in this day and age of the "democratic" web is that jibberish and slant can sit side by side with good, professional investigative journalism and get equal time. Sad.

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  76. "Let them put their name where their mouth is." Won't you just love "another fly" for setting the record, unless it is his real name of course:-)

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  77. You must be both using real names then.

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  78. “You must be both using real names then.” Not really, I don’t complain about this, but if one uses it himself he should not have double standards. Be aware Andrew, Magnus is till hovering around, he actually became a member on another site ( no plugging right:-)) yesterday.

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  79. Not really a double standard. He is not hosting an anonymous blog. His posts will also be censored - cut - deleted - or whatever if they break the law or are excessive and by posting he has accepted those terms.

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  80. However I see now Drew Noyes is launching an attack on the former British Honorary Consul Howard Miller and yet another CSD Colonel has turned up from Bangkok so I suspect in the public interest this site may not be so quiet for long with regard to Pattaya Editors.

    http://pattaya-times.com/a7762-update-to-secrets-bar-hotel-raid-leads-to-foreigner-s-arrest-links-to-websites-disclosed?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

    Thaivisa by the way are censoring remarks suggesting a motive for this attack and who made it. But they are not censoring the obvious suggestion that Howard has something to do with the sex trade. Strange logic. Howard has a case.

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  81. Thai Visa censoring? I got banned for mentioning DN and supporting Howard today. I had clocked the connection between the Pattaya Times set up and Howard. I actually PM'd Howard and one other to say I would be banned prior to it happening. That was after Howard and the other chap had "liked" my posts. My second post was about TV being out of touch with it's members view, otherwise I wouldn't have the "liked" entries. Not only banned but off all members lists. Brilliant, who invented Free Speech over at Thai Visa?

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  82. Never mind June: I think there is a class action against Thaivisa in the offing.

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  83. Niels Colov and Howard Miller run successful media 'empires' in Pattaya. As well as newspapers they run TV and radio stations providing a blanket coverage for advertisers. Drew claims he produces TV and claims to have a radio station called TITS. Yes this is true, Drew Noyes, former owner of ' Official Blowjobs' and beer bars in Duck Square tells all he runs TITS radio. A real classy guy. Of course this only exists in his vivid imagination. The word pevert comes to mind.
    Noyes ran a reletless campaign to take down Niels accusing him of many things and spreading rumors about his wife. It is alleged on the Pat Angko facebook page that he put posters of Niels wife on electricity poles alleging things that I don't wish to repeat. Now Howard is in his aim of fire. Drew is extremly jealous of their success and popularity. Howard is generally well liked even if his monotone presentations put you to sleep at night. People see that he is genuine and from expierience a gentleman to talk to. Howard helped a friend of mine with advertising his business here and said Howard could not do enough for him, going above what was promised in the contract they had together. By attacking Howard, Drew is digging an even bigger hole for himself. Howard has many friends around town and Drew has very few. Brian Wright comes to mind. Nobody hates Howard, but many hate Drew. With the current situation in pattaya it is not really fair to his family. My advice to Drew is to pack up the 10 kids and assorted wives, mia noyes and girlfriends and head back to that little shack.Give the children a good education.

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  84. Just tried to log into the pat Angko expose site. It has dissapeared. Has the head of the CSI closed it down? Did Pat back down to threats from influential people? Was bobby brooks involved? has Pat Angko been arrested and deported from Thailand? Maybe Howard may like to report on this.

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  85. What a pathetic attack on an honest guy, Drew is really scraping the barrel, fortunately for HM nobody reads Pattaya Times website or the printed version.. but unfortunately and I don't know why.. Thai Visa has reprinted his crap.. I thought they would have known better. So HM has association with Ben at Secrets.. Well Drew Noyes has association with a Paedophile that is in the thai legal system at the moment.. He needs remember that.

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  86. Terry, the P Angko site is still open as of 1435 today. Wouldn't be surprised if some kind of action isn't taken about at least some of the posts which are a bit near the bone.. Even some of the posters are wondering if there is a decoy in there already

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  87. "Just tried to log into the pat Angko expose site. It has disappeared." Terry check your internet connection :-)

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  88. I remember driving around and hearing 'TITs Radio' somewhere...I think from mamory it was Chiang Mai, but could be wrong. No idea if it is still alive and well, but it DID exist, it was real...but no idea if it was Drew Noisy's operation or not at the time, then or now if it is still up. I did not keep abreast of the situation.

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  89. Pat Angko site has disappeared now 2015

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  90. It was bound to happen, June. Too few facts; too much personal bias and vindictiveness

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  91. June Barley, fortunately yes, I am now forced to work on something which cannot be removed so easily, FB is not a good vehicle anyway. Outlook... sunny:-)

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  92. THIS IN FROM ELENA WILSON-SINGER WHO WAS ALLEGEDLY A KEY WITNESS AGAINST ME.

    "I do not wish to see anyone incarcerated in the Thai system but I have to say Drew is one who truly deserves it, if only for a short duration. A short stay in any one of these facilities should curb your appetite for any kind of felony. This man has managed, throughout the years, to put a number of people into the Thai penal system and never really thought of the consequences other than his own relief. I remember when Chris and I went every morning down to soi 7 and 8 to see what farang had managed to get himself into trouble. The sights we saw, no farang wants to see. Talking about the subject, anyone who travels a great deal, collects soaps, toothbrushes and all sorts of odds and ends. These would be greatly appreciated in the jail system and in the children's home in Pattaya. Sorry for the plug. Always after anything and everything for the children's home.
    Andrew, always keep up with un-justice of any kind.
    As you noted-the Thai justice system is variable and pliable. I think perhaps a number of people would still be after vengeance after all the harm done but I also think that would be a waste of time and wasted energy. If nothing else is accomplished, Drew is finished in the area. If Drew manages to go free then a watch has to be kept where else he starts his base. One can always be assured that he will start elsewhere if let loose.

    Elena"

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  93. Pat...should have included the swear words, maybe it would still be up. ...Elena, excellent idea re the travel items, never thought of that before...though I would rather see the kids them than the jail attendees, after all, they are all innocent and should be out soon.

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  94. I was rather hoping Pat Angko would tell us why. But perhaps that has been censored.

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  95. Facebook doesn't strike me as the right kind of home for a scandal sheet on DN....they were always going to remove it given its inflammatory and potentially libelous content...Also, the much trumpeted noyes watch site hasn't been updated since 2007!

    This site still seems the only reliable and accurate tracker of DNs capers in Pattaya

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  96. It appears that Drew is at it again over on Thaivisa. A thread is running about a police raid at a Pattaya nightspot, where an attempt is being made to smear Howard Miller by a couple of newly registered posters, pretty obviously Drew himself or one of his cohorts. Some quite nasty stuff too. Of course it is pure coincidence that Howard's was the only publication in Pattaya with the guts to report on the arrest of Noyes for blackmail and extortion. I am amazed that the mods on Thaivisa are allowing these comments, they must know who is behind them. Does Noyes have something on the powers that be at Thaivisa?

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  97. Stop press! The comments i was referring to have just been taken off and the topic locked. But these comments were up for quite a while, they were nasty, and in my opinion libelous. I hope Howard follows this up.

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  98. 14 keeps coming up. 1) 14 years of service to the King. 2)'Drummond has 14 fake names that he uses to make it look like he has followers 3)There are only 14 idiots posting under hundreds of user names. 4) Drew writes about a 14 year old pregnant girl from Secrets ago go on the front page of the pattaya times newspaper 5) Pat Angkos facebook also referred to 14 year olds in the Conman comes to Pattaya ditty.

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  99. Robroy, I have no time for Thaivisa. We all surfed the Thai forums when we first arrived thinking they were good sources of information and entertaining fun. And we all then found that that was a mirage. If the flaming doesn't get you to think again about the forum then the moderator bias will certainly do so. But most farangs love the flames and nonsense so there is no reason for George to change a successful business model. Not easy to knock a concept when the money is pouring into the bank; however wrong and unethical it is. And most farangs will still visit and contribute in their rather odd way to that site.

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  100. Let's be clear about Newspapers generally, not withstanding those available in Pattaya. Newspapers no longer provide news, as news, is now available instantly 24/7 on all our digital formats from smartphones/ tablets/ laptops. What we read in the daily morning press eg. The Bangkok Post is essentially out of date by the time we read it, as so many other events have happened between the time we read them and the time they were printed. In Pattaya, there are no Daily Newspapers, so they are dinosaurs especially the Pattaya People Newspaper, and the Pattaya Times ( is it STILL being printed).
    There may be some dribbling local issues that have some interest to those who like to have a coffee in the mornings and muse over a printed newspaper, but as tablets and kibble readers become cheaper, newspapers will be effectively extinct within 5 years worldwide. Newspapers generally sell for a dollar, and make money revenue from advertising.....get the idea here?
    Back to Pattaya, and information platforms available in that region pertaining to local news issues.
    It's a no brainier, that the Andrew Drummond digital blog, is the ONLY news vehicle available to those who want to know about important issues going on around Chon Buri, especially Pattaya with some credibility.
    Pat ANGKO shot him self in the foot by attempting to use FB to continue an ongoing site to deride two media proprieters (newspaper and local TV) without any journalistic propriety, and as we have seen, it has been extinguished, after a couple of weeks.
    I look at all the "other" stories AD puts up here, and just look at the views numbers plus the comments numbers compared to those relating to Pattaya, and it is quite obviouse that there is a willing audience in Chon Buri for issues that that affect that demographic, compared to the others, important though they may be.
    Pattaya expats obviously want " the drum" on what's going on in their part of the world, and for mine, the ANDREW DRUMMOND blog, seems to be it.
    So my suggestion is that AD turns this site into a full blown, subscriber driven digital newspaper complete with accredited journalists, both Thai and foreign, pertaining to Pattaya and surrounding regions issues, and I reckon it will set a precedent for news information in an English speaking format in Thailand, the likes of which has never been offered before.
    But again that is MY humble opinion, but if you take a futuristic look at what is happening with news dissemination globally ....I think I'm on the mark, and you can effectively kiss the " bad guys" goodbye.
    Legitimate advertisers might see it that way too.

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  101. Tim wrote "Facebook doesn’t strike me as the right kind of home for a scandal sheet". You are right, that's why I am not sad it's gone. It was a very good dry-run. Something new in the pipeline which will be revealed in due time. Still a Wiki Leaks type of blog but people can post on it. Going through blog samples and it will be untouchable by the targets. People can still read and comment without having the feeling they should get of their butt and do something too:-) It's clear that the PTY citizens have to do this themselves, nobody else sees the urgency, logic too.

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  102. The Drum should start up as a full blown news site...could be huge...us original supporters..me especially, should be given a free 5% share with no obligations.

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  103. Winston CarruthersJune 26, 2012 at 5:39 PM

    Good morning Drew, I know that you log in every morning so as to plan your day.
    It is not very nice what you have done to fellow American pimp Larry with your rubbish newspaper. I could understand your high moral ground if it where not for everything that you sensationalized in your paper regarding Larry, you have done yourself. Were you not involved in exactly the same pimping business in Soi 2 and the Duck Square a few years back? What about your new venture in Soi 13/3 Pattaya. Is this not the same thing? Whose name is this business in? I believe you spent millions of other peoples money there. Any returns expected for these 'investors' or will they end up with nothing like people who have invested in a newspaper, a restaurant, a radio station, TOPS on Second Road, housing for the poor etc. etc.
    Robroy, Thaivisa removed the libelous comments in only about 20 minutes after you posted here. Somebody must be watching this site closely. I think that would be Drew.
    So Drew is at it yet again? Newly registered 'members' taking Drew's side against Howard Miller. Drew, how stupid do you think everybody is? We know it is you everytime. Or was it Mangus Evans again? Or Vega? Or Chiangfai? Or Martine Goldberg? Or David Freeman? You have even been caught out using posting comments pretending you were Howard Miller himself. You get caught out but you keep repeating the same old trick that doesn't fool anyone except yourself.
    The fact is that nobody we know likes you and while hundreds of people have written in to this blog and Pat's, the only comments of support for you were posted by you under a 'myriad' of false names. According to Terry, you have been posting using at least 14 fake names.
    Enigma says that Pat Angko's facebook page was too light on facts. Every post was supported by a 'myriad' of documents. In fact, more than are shown on this blog. I loved reading about the "Conman Comes To Pattaya". I am looking forward to Pat Angko's expose Mark II.
    Drew will deny as always, but as shown by Andrew Drummond's recent court case, when brought in front of a judge there is plenty of evidence and Drew simply has to withdraw because it is all true. In court he was unable to prove that Andrew had lied about ANYthing. All true.
    In fact by reading the above it appears Drew agreed to drop the criminal libel, the 5 million lawsuit and demands to close down this site because Andrew Drummond had discovered a lot more of Drew's checkered past in the USA and was going to reveal it. Drew then agreed to drop the case as long as Andrew agreed not to publish the information.
    Drew, why don't you grow a set and use your REAL name. Why are you hiding behind fake names? We know it is you anyway.
    Anyway have a nice day today as I feel next week will not be a good one for you. I am now going to watch your 'Drew won't jump' and pattaya parody videos on youtube. Does it annoy you that you can not remove these?
    p.s. Be careful, Howard Miller likes dressing up as a policeman. He might arrest you and take to you with his baton.

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  104. Winston Carruthers: Actually yes there is very good stuff from the United States where one of the victims has been working over-time. But in actual fact it basically follows up and illuminates what has been presented here in one form or another. So I made no such threat. Basically I agreed that it was silly clogging up the Thai courts and have possibly a 12 year battle when it was agreed in court that as a journalist I have the right to report what is in the public interest. Besides although Noyes had libelled me I would have to lie and say I was seriously affected by it to get any serious recompense and none of his stuff was credible. His attacks only damaged himself and brought a greater following here.
    If I write about Noyes and it is a news story and in the current interest - no problem. I feel one coming on.
    I shall print the full judgment this week I suspect and while no stories will be removed I will notify readers of exactly what will be amended, if anything.

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  105. Keith Elphick wrote some sensible observations, however, "without any journalistic propriety" is not so sensible. Pat, moi, is not a journalist, doesn't want to be a journalist, doesn't want to write news etc. I am merely highlighting the rotten apples in MY society, for I live here and with many other hard working citizens hate to see the scoundrels presenting themselves as spokes men for MY local community. Keith you are a news paper man as I understand so why don't YOU take the lead instead of suggesting others to do that. There are many "bloggers" here who know exactly what to suggest others to do. Get of you collective butts and do something yourselves, in the meantime I will not be waiting and steam ahead. No, not a news site, a believe more that I can write and print documents to warn others like an anonymous whistler blower type of blog, why paint myself as a target for the scum to shoot at? It would only curtail the information I wish to disseminate. It will probably also in Thai and send to selective audiences who need to know. Thanks for having FB blocked guys, it only strengthened my resolve.

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  106. No-one is suggesting you are a journalist, Pat. And I would be surprised if anyone on here had anything to do with the Facebook problem. They are a rather big organisation don't you know and I think make their own decisions.

    I'm all for having whistle blowers and blogs giving information for fellow expats in Thaialnd, and I sincerely wish you all the best

    Maybe you just need to tone down some of your comments and get more people on side rather than make knee jerk actions. Talking of posters here 'getting off butts' and getting you banned on facebook is not doing you any favours. But anyway, good luck.

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